AnonymousInactive
Come to think of it..how do I know that she is reacting to the milk still in the nutrimigen formula…or the soy that I am eating….it is so hard with such a sensitive baby that just not breast feeding anymore seems like the logical thing to do at this point. I wish I didn’t have to stop…but it will take 2 weeks for it to completely get out of my diet and I realized that she is starting to get eczema…from the soy I am eating or the new formula??? Nuts.
questions about the blood:
what color? is it bright red & looks like blood? to me that’s a tear or it’s
from irritation lower down in the GI tract (not that I know anything,lol)
is it dark brown like coffee grounds? that’s ‘old’ blood and from higher up in the GI tract…
is she SURE it’s blood? has it been tested by hemmocult (sp?)
as for the nuts: sure, why not? they’re a protein…the way to find out is to cut them out completely for a good 2 or 3 weeks…it may or not be nuts or any other protein like milk or soy, etc…
as for constipations, etc:
exlosive blow-out poops are NORMAL for breastfed babies- we called it poop up the back blow-outs…it may not be CONSTIPATION…
http://www.askdrsears.com is also amazing, as you know…I often get links from there when mamas post that their babies have diarrhea (it’s usually NOT diarhea but loose stools…that’s why I’m saying to look into the definition of what’s going on w/ her baby’s stools…)
as for mucous: SOME is fine. just not all.the.time.
some GREEN is NORMAL, too…
from above links she can research breastfed baby poop, LOL!
AnonymousInactive
So my little 5 week old strains to poop everynight after his 2 am feeding. From about 3-7 am he groans and squirms struggling to poop or pass gas. He usualy poops by the morning or with the next feeding but it is strange because he only does this at this time. He can poop fine all day long. He is breastfed and his poops are always yellow/seedy. I am hoping it is just immaturity and will stop soon but was wondering if anyone had any thoughts on why it only happens at this time.
ugh. it’s so hard! maybe try neocate for a good 3 weeks? sometimes one formula works over another?
as for tests, you might want to ask for an endoscopy- they’ll take a look in there and see if there’s ulcerations, inflamations and they’ll take biopsies for EOS cells- that would tell you for sure if there’s an allergy, not an intolerance though…the gas & constipation sounds like MSPI- there’s a great article on page 2 on the ‘main’ MSPI link:
Mspi/allergy info(‘main page’): https://www.infantreflux.org/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=2697&PN=1&TPN=1
also, sounds crazy & I don’t want to make you more crazy
, but some babies cannot tolerate elecare or neocate due to CORN…
sue)Allergic to corn- ie no neocate: https://www.infantreflux.org/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=9319&PID=81148#81148
(sue again, replying to gina- breastfeeding ingo to (TED)https://www.infantreflux.org/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=11324&PN=1
here’s more allergy vs intolerance:
Accuracy of allergy testing & great post by sherri explaining IgE and IgG (intolerance/allergies) https://www.infantreflux.org/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=10815
Allergies-PATCH, panel, RAST testing, etc- allergies & intolerances, too:
https://www.infantreflux.org/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=11673&PN=2
and here’s just one more thing to add into the mix…can help w/ digestive issues:
AnonymousInactive
hellbennt wrote: ah…I say if baby is hungry, feed him…my baby was a comfort feeder and a silent refluxer…I breastfed on demand…meaning all the time, LOL!
but some do find smaller feedings help…others find their los aren’t ok with smaller feedings…sigh…trial & error…
is your dw (don’t get to use THAT one much, lol! mostly we’re typing aobut dh!) getting help from a lc (lactation consultant) or la leche league?
Basically that is how it has been working. When my cs (cute son) is hungry we feed him. We just do not overfeed him. Since my last post he did not anything to do with the formula. He cried and kicked and did not want it at all. I will have to talk to the nurse about that tomorrow.
As for my ldw (lovely devoted wife) she has been in contact with a dietician for the protein intolerance and what she needs to eat to avoid any problems for our son. She has done well with it thus far I think.
One more thing some of you will find funny. My wife took our son to our regular pediatrician (I always go but had work yesterday at that time) yesterday to make sure he did not have an earache or anything wrong that might be causing him pain. My wife informed her that we went to a pediatric GI on our own, without a referral from her, and that we were informed that our son has an intolerance to the protein in milk and soy. She did not think that was the case. She just said he is collicky and it will get better on its own in time. Additionally, she gave my wife some formula samples to try and guess what……..they were SOY formulas!!! That is the last time we go to that pediatrician. She also said to my wife and that formulas like Nutramigen AA, the one we are on, and Neocate, are no different than the regular formulas. The only difference is that they are expensive. She said they do nothing for the baby. When my wife told me of these events my jaw about hit the floor. My wife was taken aback by this as well. I respect doctors and all, but simply ignoring what a specialist diagnosed our son with and then claiming nothing was wrong and formulas like the one we are on are no good is ludicrous. We are in the process of finding a new pediatrician.
ah…I say if baby is hungry, feed him…my baby was a comfort feeder and a silent refluxer…I breastfed on demand…meaning all the time, LOL!
but some do find smaller feedings help…others find their los aren’t ok with smaller feedings…sigh…trial & error…
is your dw (don’t get to use THAT one much, lol! mostly we’re typing aobut dh!) getting help from a lc (lactation consultant) or la leche league?
AnonymousInactive
I remember the crying days. I used to cry most days for most of the day! It does get better but since it sounds like he is developing an aversion it may take longer than expected. I would push for more meds and look at diet/formula to see if those are contributing as well. It took us 14wks breastfeeding and 2 formula changes and 2 meds with multiple dose increases to have a happy baby (he still spit up tons and I still cried b/c of it, but he was much much happier!) It takes time to figure out the right combo. hang in there.
AnonymousInactive
Thank you for the feedback! I am breastfeeding. What should I cut out of my diet?
She does have some stinky gas. I wouldn’t say lots. She won’t take a bottle so we aren’t able to give her any formula. She does seem uncomfortable at night, she gets up every 1-2 hours if we have her laying flat. We just started using the nap nanny and she went from getting up every couple hours to almost sleeping through the night. Such a difference! But I know that the reflux is still there b/c if she is laying flat she’s fussy.
I’ve tried the marci site but my computer won’t let me do the calculator. What would they say about a 4 month old that is 13 and a half lbs?
AnonymousInactive
I think it is a good idea to go to the ER if you are getting no where. I would say this, I am a big advocate for breastfeeding if it is the best thing for baby and mommy. It is VERY difficult, and for us our babies were in the NICU and we could not breastfeed (exclusively pumping for weeks) until I eventuallly dried up. In all honesty with the frustration of feedings and the constant crying, I don’t know that I would have been able to continue breastfeeding even if I hadn’t dried up. I have the GREATEST respect for so many moms here who have figured it all out and were very successful breastfeeding, but I also have GREAT respect for the ones who decided for whatever reason, that formula was better. For me personally, I was a better mom not breastfeeding, as my emotions were way too high, I was putting too much pressure on myself to pump round the clock, and I was just falling apart. Looking back I was very post pardom with Dylan but did not recognize it then. I was a better mother elimiating that stressful piece of my life. I needed to be able to be calm (as the babies are amazing at sensing our emotions) and feedings were beyond stressful as Dylan spit up so much, at first gained weight so slowly, cried and shreiked constantly and never slept. I couldn’t figure out what I was doing wrong, where it wasn’t something I was doing wrong, I just hadn’t gotten him on the right formula/med dose yet.
When you both hit the point of exhaustion and frustration with all of this, it is really important to just work together and realize that you are both doing all you can. I will tell you our doc was not on board with the marci-kids dosing so we were at 7.5 mgs 2x a day, but for Dylan that seemed to be enough.
I don’t think there is anything wrong with going to the ER and asking for more help. Sometimes you get a good resident if you go to the teaching hospital that they are willing to look at more than a busy attending at a bigger hospital, etc… you need to just go on your own knowledge which hospital you trust more to take you seriously.
Hang in there and know that you and your wife can/should vent whenever you need to. This was such a stress for David (my husband) and I. We have been through a lot with both the boys, but the constant crying, and lack of sleep can really push us both over the edge, so we would take turns with the baby, going for walks, etc…..
Let us know what happens if you go to the ER.
AnonymousInactive
My wife is still breastfeeding and is on a strict diet per a nutritionist we met in conjunction with the pediatric GI at the University of Chicago. Our son is once again crying an awful lot tonight. I just got back from a 60-mile ride in the car. He usually can fall asleep soundly so when we get home we can put him to bed, but he woke up in the car tonight and cried for a bit. Now, back at home my wife is trying to get him to sleep as I write this.
As I look more into this situation, I am starting to think the formula is the issue. He took to it very well the first few days, but now he cries when he eats it and such. Additionally, the reflux was never as bad as it has been since he started the Nutramigen AA.
I have a few questions, my wife and I have talked about going to emergency room a few different times in the last few days. Is it worth it to go in there? Is a pediatric GI going to be there to help us? Or are they just going to do some basic tests and refer us to a doctor the next day to be checked out?
Also, our son has issues sleeping. For those of you who had your child sleeping in the bed with you, do you have any suggestions or pointers that might help us? We have his little area propped up well and I would think it would be sufficient but he just does not like sleeping anywhere other than in someone’s arms. I have no idea why, but that is the way it is. Did anyone else out there have this problem and how did you deal with it?
Lastly, I just want to say thanks to those who have replied and read about our ordeal. We are doing our best and it helps that others out there like you have some thoughts and suggestions for us. We really appreciate it.
Thanks again!
Tom
what does http://www.marci-kids.com say the dose should be?
if baby is at max dose of a PPI (prevacid, prilosec, nexium, protonix), then diet is looked at next.
are you breastfeeding or formula feeding? if formula, which one?
how is gas? lots of stinky gas? how about stools?
carafate is a good band-aid medicine…we used it…it is meant for short term. it helps heal the esophogus.
They both said the Prevacid should have kicked in by now and be working although it does not seem to be doing much as our son is still crying a lot and we always hear liquid in his esophagus and even see it in his mouth.
how long has he been on the prevacid? from everyone’s experiences it is not unusual for it to take a good 14 days to see it’s full effects
solutabs need to be given on an empty stomach, follwed by a ‘meal’ 30 minutes later to be effective- is this how you are administering it?
personally before stopping breastfeeding
(unless that is what your wife wants to do! please clarify, so that we (I!) do not go on and on about this! I certainly do not want to broach this sensitive subject if formula is your decision!)
hi & welcome!
I’m the aforementioned Laura & I have a LOT to say & (most of) it’s here:
Groupie Intro: my intro: https://www.infantreflux.org/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=853&PN=1&TPN=1
Please PLEASE take the time to read/scroll/skim through the info from this link, as it truly will help you!
if your wife would like to continue breastfeeding, then she can eliminate ALL milk & soy protein from her diet and thus her breastmilk will be like a milk & soy protein free formula…just wanted to throw that out there- however, it takes a good 2, or even 3 weeks, of eliminating these proteins from one’s diet before the milk is truly free of these proteins- and it also takes a good 2, or even 3, weeks for the proteins that have built up in baby’s system to clear out…so, regardless of formula or milk/soy free breastmilk, it can take a good 2 or 3 weeks to see any kind of changes…
when baby is on PROPER dose and it’s a PROPER form AND it’s ADMINISTERED properly, it can take up to 14 days to see it’s full effects.
solutabs need to be given on an empty stomach, follwed by a ‘meal’ 30 minutes later to be effective.
in the meantime, you can safely give the zantac, too, just make sure to give it spaced 4 hours from the PPI. here’s to calculate PROPER zantac dosing:
Zantac dosing- my/other’s question (has axid & pepcid dose, too): https://www.infantreflux.org/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=9539&PID=82914#82914
one more thought: of COURSE you want your ped GI on board!!! however, many of us, myself included, have found that they (ped GIs, peds, doctors, even some lactation consultants) are not always as up-to-date as we are here, on this board (thanks to http://www.marci-kids.com we have all done our research
)…you are your child’s advocate. please research all you can and advocate for your baby…for example: my baby was on zantac and switched to prilosec (longer story- it’s in ‘groupie intro, link is above in this post) but we were never told we could keep on w/ the zantac- well, until PPI starts to be effective, it’s as if baby isn’t on ANY meds at all! I certainly did not know this until my poor baby howled/shriekd for 24hrs straight and LOST HIS VOICE…so I called & demanded that something must be done, as this could NOT be normal, and we were given the go-ahead to give the zantac, too. another example: I had to give marci-kids info to my (open-minded, willing to learn/listen, thank G-d!) ped GI for a prevacid increase…
all of this to say that EVEN ped GIs currently do not have all the answers…NOT saying this to scare you! but to ENCOURAGE you
and this just to top everything off, LOL!
hellbennt2009-03-02 15:42:12
AnonymousInactive
First of all, thanks for the reply. We really appreciate any insight people can give. As for the questions.
monty123 wrote:
1. I would ask for Neocate. How premature was your baby? I know with preemies their tummys and GI tracts can take a bit of time to mature and catch up that this formula was a life saver for us.
One month premature. He was born on Thanksgiving 2008. My wife’s water broke inside Babies R’Us of all places.
monty123 wrote: 2. BFing, Your wife might have a lot of success making your baby more comfortable with the elimiation diet. We were not successful breastfeeding, but there are a LOT of moms here that were, so they will have lots of great advice on the elimination diet, etc….
I had just done some research about the “Elimination Diet” when we saw the pediatric GI last Monday. We also talked to a nutritionist that day who gave us a sheet of things to avoid and things to eat when trying to avoid the problems caused by allergies to the protein found in milk and soy. So, my wife has been sticking with that for the past six days. She is following the diet well. She is not eating anything bad. Thus, I would like to think her diet is not the current problem.
monty123 wrote: 3. Prevacid is a good med, but can take up to two weeks or so for the old damage to clear up in the throat and fully shut off the pumps to make your baby more comfortable. many of us have done the zantac while the prevacid was “kicking in” so to speak. They have to be spaced approx. 4 hours apart, though, but may help a bit.
This is something I am going to ask the GI nurse about tomorrow morning when I call there and let her know about the past few days. I want to see what she says. If she gives us the green light we will be sure to space out the doses by at least 4 hours.
monty123 wrote: 4. what is the prevacid dose? could be too low…
Our GI prescribed our son to take 7.5mg of prevacid once a day. She advised us to have him take it first thing in the morning. She mentioned nothing about taking it with or without food. Does this dosage seem low to you? Mind you, our son is three months old.
monty123 wrote: 5. Is the crib elevated? this can help at night…
Unfortunately, the crib has not been used yet. He hates it and has from day one. He basically sleeps in our bed. We have a nice propped up place for him to sleep. It is the only place he is willing to sleep since he was born. I know it is not normal for babies to sleep in the same bed as the parents, but I am at the foot of the bed and my wife is next to him. The little guy takes up more space on the bed than any of us. We do have him elevated on the bed quite high. We have the wedge as well as a few more things to keep him elevated.
I cross my fingers and pray everyday that we find a solution to our problem soon. As I said in my initial post, it has been a very tough three months for us so far with our son. He eats well and he does some smiling. With the new formula things seem to be getting on the right track, but there is still something not quite right. I have read that with reflux and food allergies that it is a matter of finding the right combination of formula and medication.
Thanks again for your post. We appreciate it greatly.
AnonymousInactive
Hi there and Welcome!
A couple of thoughts…
1. I would ask for Neocate. How premature was your baby? I know with preemies their tummys and GI tracts can take a bit of time to mature and catch up that this formula was a life saver for us.
2. BFing, Your wife might have a lot of success making your baby more comfortable with the elimiation diet. We were not successful breastfeeding, but there are a LOT of moms here that were, so they will have lots of great advice on the elimination diet, etc….
3. Prevacid is a good med, but can take up to two weeks or so for the old damage to clear up in the throat and fully shut off the pumps to make your baby more comfortable. many of us have done the zantac while the prevacid was “kicking in” so to speak. They have to be spaced approx. 4 hours apart, though, but may help a bit.
4. what is the prevacid dose? could be too low…
5. Is the crib elevated? this can help at night…
we did have several of these “honeymoon” periods with new formulas for a few days after we started something new and thought it was the “miracle” answer for us, but Neocate was very gentle on their systems and allowed my babies to be much more comfortable.
Hang in there! You have found a great place with a wealth of experience and information~
Ann Marie
